New: Audio Damage ADM24 Ensō Audio Buffer Module

[Funky40]

This will be for people that use live looping / sound on sound / that sort of shit in live performance.

i much likely guess that this unit won´t record all the time as the DLD does.
SOS Rec needs a "activation" right ? ( press REC button or similar)

[Crandall1]

Kidding aside, I'd like you guys to think of this as a live looper rather than a sampler. Since I'm currently laying out a potential feature set, if people would like to chime in on particular features they expect / want in a live looper (that also has an SD card) then now's the time.

The unit has 64MB of RAM, and that's not changing. Also, I don't know yet if direct-to-disk recording and streaming is possible. So keep those things in mind when floating ideas. The RAM can hold just over 3 minutes of audio total at the normal internal format, or about 5 and a half minutes if I dumb it down to 44.1/16.

[Crandall1]

i much likely guess that this unit won´t record all the time as the DLD does.
SOS Rec needs a "activation" right ? ( press REC button or similar)

I would prefer to leave it arbitrary, like the way the Live Looper works, where you can set it to work how you need. In Frippertronics-style, SOS is always on. But in modern looping, you can turn SOS on or off at need, have it activate after the initial record pass, whatever.

I would like to leave that up to the user, rather than hard-setting a method and saying THIS IS HOW YOU LOOP. Everyone works differently.

[spudboyblues]

i much likely guess that this unit won´t record all the time as the DLD does.
SOS Rec needs a "activation" right ? ( press REC button or similar)

I would prefer to leave it arbitrary, like the way the Live Looper works, where you can set it to work how you need. In Frippertronics-style, SOS is always on. But in modern looping, you can turn SOS on or off at need, have it activate after the initial record pass, whatever.

I would like to leave that up to the user, rather than hard-setting a method and saying THIS IS HOW YOU LOOP. Everyone works differently.

Would definitely like to be able to turn on / off a Sound On Sound as needed / desired as described here, NOT in the style of the DLD. The ability to have that under CV control (that, being turn looping on and off) would be great. Also very interested in the mode described earlier where the sound degrades / lowers in volume like a cassette every time it gets played back.

Building on that last point: I do really enjoy the different bit modes (e.g. an 8 bit mode, 12 bit, etc), kind of like what clouds has, where on the 8 bit mode if you drive the input, the sound will start to break up in a really nice way, and provide for longer recording times.

Separately from that - being able to change the start / end points of the loop with the screen once you've got your SOS loop in there. I don't know how complex THAT is, but that would be really cool. Nice to have, for me, but no deal breaker.

Also, are you thinking about different ways of playing through the sample in time? E.G. Forwards to a clock, reverse to a clock, "random walk" through the sample to a clock?

Again, no coding experience when it comes to developing hardware, so I have no idea how complex these features I'm asking for might be, so feel free to tell me I'm crazy!

[Multi Grooves]

Can someone with better knowledge give some examples of likely feature set differences between this and the Rossum/ER301?

I'm guessing multiple sample play back i.e. 4 channels being played back simultaneously is one.[/i]

Well, there's no one with better knowledge than me, and I'd say the fact that this doesn't have a feature set yet is one big difference. :-) Read my last comments.

----

I was going more from the point of view that you announced this was going more along the lines of the reflex than assim/301...

Unless you had one in front of you, I found the reflex thread a bit:

[polyoptics]

Would definitely like to be able to turn on / off a Sound On Sound as needed / desired as described here, NOT in the style of the DLD. The ability to have that under CV control (that, being turn looping on and off) would be great. Also very interested in the mode described earlier where the sound degrades / lowers in volume like a cassette every time it gets played back.

Building on that last point: I do really enjoy the different bit modes (e.g. an 8 bit mode, 12 bit, etc), kind of like what clouds has, where on the 8 bit mode if you drive the input, the sound will start to break up in a really nice way, and provide for longer recording times.

Yah, there is something nice sometimes about the loop degrading over time, where you have to go back to it and freshen up the elements that leads to a lot of layering and some gently forced changes over time, and a lot of volume dynamics.

One random comment : I really don't like the 'slow' knobs for quick SoS edits. Loose knobs like those on the phonogene are a god send imho, for doing ducking FX or clipping off bits of the incoming sound (grabbing a tiny portion of a snare hit requires a very fast twist on the knobs, that is really a nuisance on the DLD for example. It's is a great way to make up some extra percussion sounds)

Also, for what its worth : SoS with phonogene is a one knob action (in broken echo mode) and I absolutely love the raw simplicity of that. However, everyone wants to do things a different way... One thing I liked about the DLD firmware was that you could change what the knobs were assigned to in a system mode. To take that a step further, it would be really cool to have a knob dedicated to this, where you could choose/assign what happens when its all the way left and all the way right with multiple functions (mix/feedback/SoS levels etc). Maybe even to save those as presets and be able to change through a few presets on this knob as you perform. Just 'what if' thinking there

[Crandall1]

I was going more from the point of view that you announced this was going more along the lines of the reflex than assim/301...

I only just read the Reflex thread. I don't have anything to say about that, other than that is one approach to solving a problem that has many other approaches. The addition of a screen makes a lot of difference, but I don't have much personal interest in slicing and the like, and both Reflex and the Phonogene seem hell-bent on making slices the raison d'être of the device.

Speaking strictly for myself, I like the way the Eventide TimeFactor (and H9) approaches looping, and I also like the way the Count To Five pedal works. I personally do all my looping with either the Ableton Looper plug or my Nagra or Otari tape decks. Since we tend to design to our own needs first, what I plan to do in the initial run-up is make something that generally makes me happy and works like the Live Looper and/or a real tape deck. Then I'll trot it out here with a video so you guys can see where I'm at, and we'll adjust accordingly.

Regarding the knobs, we're never putting knobs on our modules again that aren't panel-bolted and with a grease code somewhere North of Silly Putty, after all the dumb "wiggly pot" comments we had to deal with in the first couple years of our modular adventure. Also, I wouldn't put a control like that on a knob in the first place, so problem solved.

[connect_icut]

Very excited about this. Hoping it will be able to truly replace the granular sample player I built for my old Max/MSP patches.

Currently, I'm using two Q-Bit Nebulaes and they're great but the lack of a screen is a real sticking point. Also, the nebulae really just treats granulation as an effect. I'm hoping this thing will get more into actual granular synthesis.

And FWIW, I'm more interested in a sample playback module than a live sampler but my Max patches did both, so I'm glad to hear that this module will also play files and live sample.

[jonne74]

I wouldn't mind an option for lo-fi recording. It's one of the reasons I really love the Phonogene, just wish it had more memory.

[bobbcorr]

Kidding aside, I'd like you guys to think of this as a live looper rather than a sampler. Since I'm currently laying out a potential feature set, if people would like to chime in on particular features they expect / want in a live looper (that also has an SD card) then now's the time.

The unit has 64MB of RAM, and that's not changing. Also, I don't know yet if direct-to-disk recording and streaming is possible. So keep those things in mind when floating ideas. The RAM can hold just over 3 minutes of audio total at the normal internal format, or about 5 and a half minutes if I dumb it down to 44.1/16.

Given all the pedal loopers, the potential feature set is pretty big. Off the top of my head here are some use cases:

1. Multiple inputs - it is likely the user will have multiple voices that would benefit from being recorded
2. Each input can be recorded, looped and dropped without affecting (effecting?) the other tracks
3. Preview - instead of piping an input to the looper, give it a listen beforehand
4. Mute inputs - while inputs are looping, the user can mute out one or more of the channels from the loop. It would be interesting if you could mute out one looping element while previewing the input to decide if you want to pass that lick into the looper
5. Play through without looping - each input can pass through the looper without being looped or impacting the currently looping/muted inputs
6. Merge tracks/mix down - a way to push two tracks together to open up space for new input on a channel
7. Save looping input to SD card - imagine storing a bunch of loops, then calling them up later...wooo...

It's a really interesting logic problem. Please ignore my incoherent ramblings.

[spudboyblues]

Yah, there is something nice sometimes about the loop degrading over time, where you have to go back to it and freshen up the elements that leads to a lot of layering and some gently forced changes over time, and a lot of volume dynamics.

...

To take that a step further, it would be really cool to have a knob dedicated to this, where you could choose/assign what happens when its all the way left and all the way right with multiple functions (mix/feedback/SoS levels etc). Maybe even to save those as presets and be able to change through a few presets on this knob as you perform. Just 'what if' thinking there

Agreed entirely on the first point. And I think actually on the Phonogene: at the beginning people didn't like the sound quality of the module, BECAUSE it was marketed as a "high end" or "super clean" sampler. I think if you really play it right and market it as something with "cassette character" that you can toggle between with different bit modes, but still get that clean sampler at high bit rates, I think you'll please both crowds.

W/R/T the multiple knobs doing different things in different modes...I'm less sold. It would have to make a ton of sense, I think, in order for me to feel good about it. Even on modules like Clouds I sometimes get lost, especially with parasites. (Though I will say, the DLD is better than the clouds with this) It's sometimes frustrating. I wouldn't want this to become that! I love the AD modules for their visual and functional simplicity (which translates to very, very deep possibilities when it comes to the FX themselves). I would hope that the sampler continues that!

[polyoptics]

W/R/T the multiple knobs doing different things in different modes...I'm less sold. It would have to make a ton of sense, I think, in order for me to feel good about it. Even on modules like Clouds I sometimes get lost, especially with parasites. (Though I will say, the DLD is better than the clouds with this) It's sometimes frustrating. I wouldn't want this to become that! I love the AD modules for their visual and functional simplicity (which translates to very, very deep possibilities when it comes to the FX themselves). I would hope that the sampler continues that!

Yes I agree there, I think I explained it poorly -- I was thinking less like multifunction knobs (I don't care for those either) and something more like a very very basic version of say.. Frames/OctaTrackSlider. Something to customize for our performance -- each artists' use case is different.

[Zymos]

Not that interested in loop slicing, but graphic loop trimming would be awesome.

Creative mangling, munging, granulization is what I hope to see- stuff in a different direction from what the DLD does.

[Crandall1]

W/R/T the multiple knobs doing different things in different modes...I'm less sold. It would have to make a ton of sense, I think, in order for me to feel good about it. Even on modules like Clouds I sometimes get lost, especially with parasites. (Though I will say, the DLD is better than the clouds with this) It's sometimes frustrating. I wouldn't want this to become that! I love the AD modules for their visual and functional simplicity (which translates to very, very deep possibilities when it comes to the FX themselves). I would hope that the sampler continues that!

Thanks for the kind words. But yeah, we really dislike multiple function knobs. I really had to grit my teeth to do it in Shapes. I don't have any particular problem with the sound of Mutable stuff, but user interfaces with hidden functions and multi mode panel controls is so entirely outside of how I'm comfortable working that it becomes a deal-breaker for me, and I'm sure not going to put it on one of our products.

(This is a matter of personal taste as a designer, and is not a knock on Olivier. I wish, in my wettest dreams, we were able to come up with something that captured a 10th of his zeitgeist.)

So that sort of 10-tons-of-shit-in-a-5-ton-bag design ethos is off the table. I don't mind stacking functions, but they have to be one button away from the front panel.

[Funky40]

i much likely guess that this unit won´t record all the time as the DLD does.
SOS Rec needs a "activation" right ? ( press REC button or similar)

I would prefer to leave it arbitrary, like the way the Live Looper works, where you can set it to work how you need. In Frippertronics-style, SOS is always on. But in modern looping, you can turn SOS on or off at need, have it activate after the initial record pass, whatever.

I would like to leave that up to the user, rather than hard-setting a method and saying THIS IS HOW YOU LOOP. Everyone works differently.

I agree: there are many ways to work.......

my question came from here:
the DLD is recording/looping all the time.
The DLD has a feed attenuator which is the way to control, as it says, what you feed.
my point here is:
if you play a instrument and want to feed just some short snippets to SOS within continued playing, turning a feed pot is not fast enough, it smears.

so my request here:
having a dedicated button/switch to activate recording ............respectivly to mute/activate the "feed".
( beside having a input/feed attenuator which is a good thing anyway )
ideally, that activate button would prevent from getting plopps or so.


Chris, thanks for caring !

[Funky40]

another request:
(the Electrix Repeater does it)
....transient detection for the first attack phase of the recording,
plus "slipping" the recording so that some emty space in the begin of the recording is cancelled out.
( this one should be on/off settable as a user-option)



kinda OT:
i agree: do YOUR thing.
one cook !
........one way to look at such sampler-looper module !
trying to incorporate many ways of working into one sampler module might kill the concept. My opinion
Though i think, my two requests should match any style of working

( JFYI: i draw my own Dream-Sampler concept down to paper over a course of threee Years, with ideas in it that were way older.
.........i have an idea to where samplers can be taken.
A main conclusion of that time was for me: that a sampler should be conceptionalised to a specific view and way of working )

[spudboyblues]

Crandall1

Definitely no knock on Mutable / Oliver. I have (and enjoy) many of his modules, and am constantly grateful for his thinking and designs. That being said, for *this* module and it's particular functions, I agree with what you've said.

Thanks for opening this up for discussion - very fun to think about!

Funky40

I don't actually know that the "slipping" to first transient would be the most useful, especially if there are manual start and end point knobs, as were shown on the demo unit. One could easily trim to avoid beginning transients, and sync the loop with a clock. Just my two cents - sometimes I like the beginning moments before transients which, with the right distortion and compression, lend a certain space and swelling into a percussive hit.

Also really into your idea of the on-off switch for the feed into the SOS - I wonder if it should be a button or a CV input that accepts triggers? Or both?

[ignatius]

will it have a flanger mode?

srsly though.. granular muncher sounds appealing to me. if it offers a lot in this regard i'll be into. i still don't know how to use loopers in my music :( but i know everyone else does awesome stuff w/loopers.

I think if there's some kind beat munching.beat munging offline processing too that'd be cool. transform reverse boomerang like Peak editor offered or anything weird like that.. the offline file processing of samplers of old could be pretty cool. but that's probably not something in the scope of use for a looper in most scenarios.

random glitchy abilities even if that's left up to CV duties and patching.

[noisejockey]

Since we're all pig-piling on the feature ideas...

If there's any way for the buffer to hold multiple "layers" (possibly infeasible due to audio engine and RAM, granted), multiple outputs would be amazing for signal routing. Sampling from multiple inputs could be handled with an external switch. I've wanted this in my guitar looper for years.

I think CV addressability of playback position is always a fun option, and isn't slicing in the strictest sense, and retriggering position (randomized?) via gate or trigger input allows for glitchy happiness. Determining the playback "window"/length via CV would also be great, again, not slicing per se. Gets more granular more quickererer. :-) I'm imagining Samplr on iOS as a model here.

+1 on the ability to have a lower-fidelity option for both grit and duration. CV control over playback fidelity is fun, but maybe people just need to get a Malgorithm at that point?

Definitely agree with previous comments on nice and time synced SOS and recording, as well. Time synchronization of effects is one of AD's strengths, IMO. Actual loop amplitude drop/decay, per overdub or by time or by incoming clock ticks (e.g., -1dB per pulse), would be amazing.

All that said, Chris, one of the strengths of many modules (yours included) is indeed simplicity. Hope this thread spurs some thoughts but that ultimately the feature set is focused and not scope-creepy. A simple module with a strong design philosophy is almost always better. If this was a Pigtronix Infinity on the I/O and Samplr in RAM, that'd hit it into a must-buy sweet spot for me.

[Ras Thavas]

Since you asked Chris, I'll join the crowd

This is going to be a live looper, and is likely to have some horsepower and interface possibilities beyond the basic, I'd suggest looking first to make the most comfortable live looping solution you can, then see what value/features you can add that would fit with what you've designed and offer something the other products don't as yet.

I'll toss out the idea of "States" or "Breadcrumbs". Basically being able to bookmark a particular range of memory and call it back with a CV and/or trigger. You could have your initial loop, perhaps two overdubs down the road you may want to save a state, later you completely change it up and wish to save that state, etc. There would likely be automatic states for undo and redo as well.

Going further perhaps the states would remember granular playback settings, and any other additional features that might be developed.

So you could have these different versions of your loop, be able to go back to them in any order, add to them, then revert, and maybe even set them to play back in an arbitrary order...

This isn't exactly slices, but more like a new level of flexibility with related loops.

Obviously this is dependent on memory, access speed, and how the heck you could design an interface that makes this easy and clear.

[Infinity Curve]

Kidding aside, I'd like you guys to think of this as a live looper rather than a sampler. Since I'm currently laying out a potential feature set, if people would like to chime in on particular features they expect / want in a live looper (that also has an SD card) then now's the time.

The unit has 64MB of RAM, and that's not changing. Also, I don't know yet if direct-to-disk recording and streaming is possible. So keep those things in mind when floating ideas. The RAM can hold just over 3 minutes of audio total at the normal internal format, or about 5 and a half minutes if I dumb it down to 44.1/16.

Given all the pedal loopers, the potential feature set is pretty big. Off the top of my head here are some use cases:

1. Multiple inputs - it is likely the user will have multiple voices that would benefit from being recorded
2. Each input can be recorded, looped and dropped without affecting (effecting?) the other tracks
3. Preview - instead of piping an input to the looper, give it a listen beforehand
4. Mute inputs - while inputs are looping, the user can mute out one or more of the channels from the loop. It would be interesting if you could mute out one looping element while previewing the input to decide if you want to pass that lick into the looper
5. Play through without looping - each input can pass through the looper without being looped or impacting the currently looping/muted inputs
6. Merge tracks/mix down - a way to push two tracks together to open up space for new input on a channel
7. Save looping input to SD card - imagine storing a bunch of loops, then calling them up later...wooo...

It's a really interesting logic problem. Please ignore my incoherent ramblings.

Want you want is ableton

[bobbcorr]

Kidding aside, I'd like you guys to think of this as a live looper rather than a sampler. Since I'm currently laying out a potential feature set, if people would like to chime in on particular features they expect / want in a live looper (that also has an SD card) then now's the time.

The unit has 64MB of RAM, and that's not changing. Also, I don't know yet if direct-to-disk recording and streaming is possible. So keep those things in mind when floating ideas. The RAM can hold just over 3 minutes of audio total at the normal internal format, or about 5 and a half minutes if I dumb it down to 44.1/16.

Given all the pedal loopers, the potential feature set is pretty big. Off the top of my head here are some use cases:

1. Multiple inputs - it is likely the user will have multiple voices that would benefit from being recorded
2. Each input can be recorded, looped and dropped without affecting (effecting?) the other tracks
3. Preview - instead of piping an input to the looper, give it a listen beforehand
4. Mute inputs - while inputs are looping, the user can mute out one or more of the channels from the loop. It would be interesting if you could mute out one looping element while previewing the input to decide if you want to pass that lick into the looper
5. Play through without looping - each input can pass through the looper without being looped or impacting the currently looping/muted inputs
6. Merge tracks/mix down - a way to push two tracks together to open up space for new input on a channel
7. Save looping input to SD card - imagine storing a bunch of loops, then calling them up later...wooo...

It's a really interesting logic problem. Please ignore my incoherent ramblings.

Want you want is ableton

Oh, and it should shoot rainbows out of its bolted-as-f^^^ pots.

[onthelees]

My input:

1. Don't accept too much input. If you do, this product will try and be everything, and won't do anything well. Stick to your vision.

2. Don't re-invent the 4ms DLD. It is really cool, but it's a delay, not a sampler, and there's no editing.

3. Make good use of that cool OLED screen. You have a chance to offer some precise control over waveforms, and editing in the module. Nobody else has gone that direction much.

[windspirit]

I know this may be a whole other ball game but the pitch synchronous grainular mode on clouds is freakin awesome.

Its hard to tell if this is already implemented (and I havent combed the thread) but to me triggered recording is a must on a modular looper but also triggered overdub would be pretty cool.

[connect_icut]

Okay, FWIW, here's my feature wish list:
* Samples can loop autonomously or be triggered externally
* Samples can be loaded from an SD card or recorded on the fly
* Screen displays waveform and file name of loaded sample
* Loop end points can be adjusted manually or modulated with CV
* Grains can be turned on or off
* Duration can be adjusted manually
* No pitch correction when duration is adjusted with grains off
* Pitch correction when duration is adjusted with grains on
* Stepped (by octave) pitch shifting when grains are on
* Grain rate can be adjusted manually or modulated with CV
* Grains can be shifted and overlaid to create granular clouds

Think that's about it. Fingers crossed!