considering Max/Msp

Reaktor, MAX/MSP, VST/AU, etc. A place for all things soft....

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AR126
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considering Max/Msp

Post by AR126 » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:41 pm

i'm pretty sure this has been asked a million times...
i've been thinking about getting Max for years,but my programming/design
skills are zip...
i tried the demo a while back and was pretty overwhelmed by it.
i'm thinking perhaps my overall technical ability is a bit better now, and
it does seem like Max can do a lot of different stuff.
when i first tried it,i had no experience w/modular patching(which is no
longer the case)
anyway,i have a little more experience,but still no programming chops,
is Max a realistic endeavour?
thanks
(sorry if this is a dumb question)
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Post by adam » Wed Oct 22, 2014 12:50 pm

yeah, you'd be able to do something with it - you could try pd first, it's free http://puredata.info/

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Post by AR126 » Wed Oct 22, 2014 1:39 pm

thanks very much!
i messed around w/Processing a while back(for video stuff)and aside
from being able to do particle trails,didn't get too far...
anyway,i'll check out pd and see what happens.
thanks again
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Post by ignatius » Wed Oct 22, 2014 1:57 pm

this thread will be helpful regarding the coming max update

viewtopic.php?t=119957

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Post by renderful » Wed Oct 22, 2014 3:37 pm

AR126 wrote:thanks very much!
i messed around w/Processing a while back(for video stuff)and aside
from being able to do particle trails,didn't get too far...
anyway,i'll check out pd and see what happens.
thanks again
Processing is not very similar to Max. The guy who made Max/MSP also made PD. It is very similar to wrap your head around. I go back and forth between the two and find my skills from each transfer directly.

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Post by hamildad » Wed Oct 22, 2014 3:56 pm

I say go for it.

me and _seph are stating to learn Max round about now, so it seems like with MAX7 incoming, its a good time to learn...

depends on how much time you can give it, and how likely you are to drop it when it gets tricky.

I'm trying to move away from the module buying game for a while as I've almost finished my 6U and dont see myself adding another skiff/3U expansion any time soon. So i'm looking for something that'll be expandable and play nice with my modular.

the fact that I got a Monome Grid64 was the last straw as I started to see all the possibilities of using them all at once.

I'm on tutorial 1.2 at the moment though, so give me a year or so... :hmm:

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Post by AR126 » Wed Oct 22, 2014 6:05 pm

cool, thanks for the feedback all...
i'm starting to lean in that direction, now.
i can't really think of any outboard gear that's essential
at the moment,so this may well be the time to do it.
i do have lots of time on my hands,so i got that much.
actually having any guts when it gets difficult is not something
i can foretell(or dismiss,really)
it doesn't cost all that much when you consider pricey VIs and
sound libraries...
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Post by _seph » Thu Oct 23, 2014 9:24 am

and now is a good time to get started as Cycling74 is currently running a promotion leading up to the release of MAX 7, providing a discount on v.6 and a free upgrade.

following the purchase of a Nord Modular, I originally purchased MAX/MSP back in 2001 (which was v.4) and I took to it fairly quickly. back then there wasn't a large community and I'm by no means a programmer aside from kid stuff on the AppleII and C64, plus general DOS and HTML ...the basics of an 80's nerd-child. anyway, by following the tutorials I was able to quickly acclimate to MAX and made some good progress ...then I bought a Kyma system and found myself spread too thin, well over my head and at a standstill.

years later the introduction of MAX for Live was the perfect vehicle to ease back into the world of MAX and it would be a excellent starting point if you're a Live user as it now comes included with the v.9 Suite.

so far what they've teased of MAX 7 looks great. while processing my upgrade I spoke briefly with a Cycling74 sales rep who explained that 7 now has built-in interactive lessons and is more a self-exploring experience, which I'm very eager to see.

the only real advice I can share as one who previously failed at dealing with the infinite potential of the blank canvas is to have a goal in mind. with a modular synth it is easy to get lost in the wires, but at least your modules are finite ...patching in MAX can be somewhat like staring into the abyss.

a very good resource- http://cycling74.com/project/maxmsp-book/

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Post by AR126 » Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:50 am

thank-you all for the advice and encouragement!
i downloaded Pure Data last nite,and well,you know, it's like.....
be that as it may,MAX still fascinates me so this is really tempting.
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Post by RajaTheWigglinWanker » Thu Oct 23, 2014 9:23 pm

_seph wrote:I'm by no means a programmer aside from kid stuff on the AppleII and C64, plus general DOS and HTML ...the basics of an 80's nerd-child.
Sounds like my childhood :tu:

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Post by kwaidan » Thu Oct 23, 2014 10:08 pm

One thing that I never liked about Max for Live was their help. Query a basic command and you get countless hits. Now some are good and contain sample routines, but you can't copy them. In addition, you can't easily print out a help page. This may have changed in more recent versions, but I gave up a long time ago.

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Post by AR126 » Fri Oct 24, 2014 6:48 am

something to consider....
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Post by secretkillerofnames » Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:14 pm

kwaidan wrote:This may have changed in more recent versions, but I gave up a long time ago.
As someone who has been working with Max off and on since V4, my impression is the contextual help improved greatly in V6. Also they made the reference easier to follow and each in/out has a pop up showing what it expects.
So i'd say user friendliness increase exponentially.

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Post by AR126 » Sun Oct 26, 2014 5:49 pm

thanks much,
that's very good to know...
before i download the Max demo,i thought i'd get a feel for
Pure Data first.
anybody happen to know how long Max6 will be on discount?
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Post by _seph » Mon Oct 27, 2014 6:13 pm

AR126 wrote:anybody happen to know how long Max6 will be on discount?
until the new version releases, which is happening soon, although "soon" has not been defined but I wouldn't be surprised if this is the final week.

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Post by AR126 » Tue Oct 28, 2014 6:39 am

thanks,
the discount's not a make or break issue,i was just
wondering.
you're right about "soon"being a subjective time frame.
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Post by revmutt » Tue Oct 28, 2014 6:53 am

I have used Max since the early 90's. I am not an expert or in anyway a skilled user. I have never really tried to learn how to use it beyond what I need to know for whatever specific project I am doing.

I love Max and find that it is extremely usable and gratifying for anyone who has the verve to just shoot for it.

I should add that I have even kept up with upgrades during periods where I wasn't using it a lot because even the demos are enjoyable.

Try it with whatever your best adventure attitude is.
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Post by AR126 » Tue Oct 28, 2014 10:19 am

thanks,
that sounds like a very practical approach...
seems better to have than not.
whenever i stop feeling like a horse kicked me in
the face(dental work),i'll check the demo out.
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Post by spacessound » Mon Nov 03, 2014 5:49 pm

I was in a similar boat having downloaded trials and never progressing but a few months ago, from within Max for live, I carefully followed the video tutorials and it kind of clicked at a certain point.

As mentioned Max 6 context help is well implemented so that is great too

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Post by ryangaston » Tue Nov 04, 2014 4:42 pm

I am 100% for you learning Max. It's really fantastic, and not nearly as overwhelming as it might seem at first (especially if you have experience with modular patching and have a strong grasp of general "signal flow").

PD is also great, but a bit glitchier. And it doesn't have all of the readymade objects that Max does--I find that often you need to use several PD objects in conjunction to emulate the function of a single Max object (so you have to be a bit more creative with your patching).

One of the fantastic things about Max is its product documentation--the "help" files are working patchers, so it's easy to get started even without external courses/tutorials.

If you're starting out with PD, though, you might find some of this stuff of use. It's a really good site for demonstrating how to achieve basic synthesis functions/typical common sound generation/manipulation systems in PD.

Best of luck!

http://en.flossmanuals.net/pure-data/ :nana:

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Post by hamildad » Tue Nov 04, 2014 5:14 pm

I've just bought MAX to get the 20% discount and auto upgrade to 7,

working my way slowly through the book everyone recommends.

knowing modular architecture so much, its hard to stay on the basic stuff when my head is full of possibilities of what I can do with MIDI, CV and all that other good stuff but I am enjoying the basics and the fun for me is REALLY understanding what I am doing, rather than using something which has more functional tools for beginner but you are still patching pretend modules.

a good comparison is Audulus which has a ADSR module and all the work with line commands and slewing to get a ADSR in MAX.

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Post by secretkillerofnames » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:42 am

hamildad wrote:I've just bought MAX to get the 20% discount and auto upgrade to 7,

working my way slowly through the book everyone recommends.

knowing modular architecture so much, its hard to stay on the basic stuff when my head is full of possibilities of what I can do with MIDI, CV and all that other good stuff but I am enjoying the basics and the fun for me is REALLY understanding what I am doing, rather than using something which has more functional tools for beginner but you are still patching pretend modules.

a good comparison is Audulus which has a ADSR module and all the work with line commands and slewing to get a ADSR in MAX.
You might appreciate BEAP - which is apparently embedded in Max7 but can be added to Max6. I'm all for using predefined modules over building them from scratch but having access to both approaches is valuable IMHO.

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Post by hamildad » Wed Nov 05, 2014 8:27 am

I saw that BEAP was included in 7, it was one of the things that pushed me over the edge into buying it.


ideally I'd like to join up the Max side of things with the monome and modular side of things, and this seems to be the way to do it.

right now when I look at some of the BEAP stuff on github i'm :despair:

but given time it I'll start to understand it.

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Post by AR126 » Wed Nov 05, 2014 8:33 am

thanks all,
i've been checking the forum daily,and somehow failed to detect the
latest replies(my shamefaced apologies...)
an aquaintance of mine said(regarding Max)"don't do it man,you'll
need courses for it.get Bidule instead..."
that being said, the MW folks have been making a very strong case
for Max.
i installed the demo on monday,but "things"have gotten disruptive
in other areas of concern(totally lame excuse,but...)
anyway,i'm going see how far i can get today.
profound thanks A.
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Post by secretkillerofnames » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:45 pm

hamildad wrote:I saw that BEAP was included in 7, it was one of the things that pushed me over the edge into buying it.


ideally I'd like to join up the Max side of things with the monome and modular side of things, and this seems to be the way to do it.

right now when I look at some of the BEAP stuff on github i'm :despair:

but given time it I'll start to understand it.
This might get you started. It's certainly a level up from trad max objects - closer to Reaktor but easier than that even. You'll be right mate! ;)

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