Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Voltcontrol » Mon Mar 09, 2020 10:58 am

Whichever way you look at it, B. has piqued our interest (from the most of us at least) again with this upcoming Brophet 800 or so it seems.
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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by thee ghost ov n_phay » Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:48 am

Never thought that the prophet 600 was all that special? I mean it was okay, but....

Seems like a weird choice for a new clone.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Bob Borries » Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:37 pm

This is an un-official Mock-up, but i really want this.
Image
I think the membrane switches on the original Prophet 600 probably aren't working so good after all this time. I wonder if they'll add Noise or a 2nd LFO?
8 Voices is pretty amazing, Curtis filters or SSM2044 filters would sound better, is it stereo?

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Analog Prophet » Mon Mar 09, 2020 4:45 pm

beyourdog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:40 am

The P600 is NOT a great synth, the P5 is, sound is good, the resonance is really musical too on a P5, it has its issues, but overall, the P5 is class.
With all respect, to me its a great synth as the sound is great in my ears. I could certainly have use of a P600 and would love to have a P5 or P10, a CS80, a DX1, a GX1, a Moog System 55 with 54 VCOs and a dancing elephant at the living room table accompanied by a choir of HAL 9000 singing ‘Daisy Daisy’ in Russian and would happily rob a money train or two to be able to afford that, but my wife would be harder to convince - a P600 would be easier as it still is a great synth.
The best beat of any music
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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by beyourdog » Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:26 pm

Bob Borries wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:37 pm
This is an un-official Mock-up, but i really want this.
Image
I think the membrane switches on the original Prophet 600 probably aren't working so good after all this time. I wonder if they'll add Noise or a 2nd LFO?
8 Voices is pretty amazing, Curtis filters or SSM2044 filters would sound better, is it stereo?
But then, it becomes a P5....they inly share the same BCO chips...
Interesting page for chips used in synths: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEM_and ... nthesizers

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Bob Borries » Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:54 pm

beyourdog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:26 pm
Bob Borries wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:37 pm
Curtis filters or SSM2044 filters would sound better, is it stereo?
But then, it becomes a P5....they inly share the same BCO chips...
Interesting page for chips used in synths: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEM_and ... nthesizers
Yeah I hear you, but I remember when the Prophet 600 came out at NAMM, I thought wow 6 voices instead of 5 like the Prophet 5, but when I played it it didn't sound as bright and good as the Prophet 5. Was it cheaper VCA's that dulled the sound? Something was up with it, but I'm sure Behringer will try to make it sound better than the original Prophet 600. I appreciate Behringer's dedication to original circuit designs, but some designs need improving!

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Wracked with Guilt » Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:51 pm

I’ve had my GliGli P600 up against a Rev 3 P5 and concluded that the P600 resonance was considerably harsher. Also the filter didn’t seem to open quite as fully as the P5, resulting in a somewhat murkier, less hi-fi sound. I actually preferred the P600 to be honest, but can totally understand that many folks won’t agree. Lack of a noise source is more of an issue to me.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by beyourdog » Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:55 pm

Bob Borries wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:54 pm
beyourdog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:26 pm
Bob Borries wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:37 pm
Curtis filters or SSM2044 filters would sound better, is it stereo?
But then, it becomes a P5....they inly share the same BCO chips...
Interesting page for chips used in synths: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEM_and ... nthesizers
Yeah I hear you, but I remember when the Prophet 600 came out at NAMM, I thought wow 6 voices instead of 5 like the Prophet 5, but when I played it it didn't sound as bright and good as the Prophet 5. Was it cheaper VCA's that dulled the sound? Something was up with it, but I'm sure Behringer will try to make it sound better than the original Prophet 600. I appreciate Behringer's dedication to original circuit designs, but some designs need improving!
Different VCF, VCA, signal path very probably...

Resonance in the P5 is very musical...

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by numan7 » Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:42 pm

:hmm: i think it might be interesting if they came out with a full keyboard version of this at some point that used the ds-80 keybed to transform this into a sort of born-again prophet-t8.


cheers
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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Voltcontrol » Tue Mar 10, 2020 2:40 am

Wracked with Guilt wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:51 pm
I’ve had my GliGli P600 up against a Rev 3 P5 and concluded that the P600 resonance was considerably harsher. Also the filter didn’t seem to open quite as fully as the P5, resulting in a somewhat murkier, less hi-fi sound. I actually preferred the P600 to be honest, but can totally understand that many folks won’t agree. Lack of a noise source is more of an issue to me.
This to me, sounds very promising. Will be one of those 'not for most but loved by some' synths, also think it will sell well.
Really hoping it fits above description. Additional noise source and wild FM' ing range would be hugely appreciated in this recipe.

Really hoping that it will be module, but it definitely looks like it will be.
Gaun Yersel!

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by brek01 » Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:03 am

well i guess there will be a market for it. I am stopping with the 3 B's i have at mo. (model D, neutron and Pro 1) kinda odd journey, I started with the neutron, then bought 3 model D's, then realised that they would be a pain to make a pseudo polysynth from, sold one as it was new and unboxed, and have literally just swapped the second one with some cash for the Pro 1. But keep them coming Uli plenty of others are chomping at the bit for new old stock.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by StillNotWorking » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:15 am

8 voice analog with formfactor to fit in euro it is doomed for success. But where is the Gate Input? :despair:
looking for service manual for the Clavia ddrum AT or ddrum III

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by ObsoleteModular » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:31 am

Does it come with racist slurs against and intimidation of music tech journalists?

tenembre

Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by tenembre » Tue Mar 10, 2020 12:52 pm

ObsoleteModular wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:31 am
Does it come with racist slurs against and intimidation of music tech journalists?
Thread for those kinds of topics is here: https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewt ... 3&t=226390

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Wracked with Guilt » Tue Mar 10, 2020 1:53 pm

numan7 wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:42 pm
:hmm: i think it might be interesting if they came out with a full keyboard version of this at some point that used the ds-80 keybed to transform this into a sort of born-again prophet-t8.


cheers
now that would be quite something, especially if it added the T8's split/layers as well as its poly aftertouch. Add a nice wooden case like the PolyD and charge :75:

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by blw » Wed Mar 11, 2020 8:27 pm

I was listening to a track I did in the 90's with my 600. I think it sounds pretty cool. Ok, not P-5 cool, but cool still. The poly mod section was my first exposure to audio rate modulation, and I fell in love. Mine's memory was mostly filled with trippy weird sounds that were little more than textures. The bar band keyboardist that bought it from me must have been scratching his head. A 3U version with patch memory seems pretty appealing to have stuff like that queued up for a live set or whatnot.

The filter stepping is a pretty big deal if you play the filter live or when recording, but to my sometimes mistaken memory, it only stepped when turn the knob, not when modulating the filter. Not really much of a limitation to me. Maybe this product is just stirring up a bit of nostalgia and giving me a rose-colored view.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by blw » Wed Mar 11, 2020 8:41 pm

Double post
Last edited by blw on Thu Mar 12, 2020 10:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by DesolationBlvd » Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:31 am

Bob Borries wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:37 pm
This is an un-official Mock-up, but i really want this.
Image
I think the membrane switches on the original Prophet 600 probably aren't working so good after all this time. I wonder if they'll add Noise or a 2nd LFO?
8 Voices is pretty amazing, Curtis filters or SSM2044 filters would sound better, is it stereo?
Maybe that column of knobs between the oscillator and filter controls could be Volume A / Volume B / Noise / Glide?

SSM2044? No. That was never used in the classic Prophet series.

If they get this right (maybe add the missing Pulse Width in Poly-Mod destinations through a bit of menu diving?), I'll go for this over Prophet-6.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by (((EMP))) » Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:42 am

beyourdog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:40 am
Analog Prophet wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:35 am
Prophet 600 is a great synth, no doubt, with the old classic vibe. The new Prophets are great as well, especial the P6, P12 and the Rev2. The new Pro 3 is promising. But still missing a modern P5, hope that’s on Behringer’s list - if not Uncle Dave get the brilliant idea of making a Prophet 5 (rev 2) ReIssue - it would sell even more than the original ever did.
The P600 is NOT a great synth, the P5 is, sound is good, the resonance is really musical too on a P5, it has its issues, but overall, the P5 is class.

The P600 was cheaply made, really plastic, with some annoying thimgs like shitty envelops and a very annoying stepping filter, pretty dark too....Funny thing to play, but really second rate...Let’s stop for a minute transforming any vintage piece of shit into some unique and rare thing, because it is not....Anyone remember ordering the P600 plastic membrane to the company who was selling the leftovers parts from Sequentials like 17 years ago??? Indid, and then I got ride of it, not worth it...
While I wouldn’t go this far, I do agree the P600 is mediocre and an odd choice as a clone? Just cause a synth is from the 80’s and “analog” doesn’t make it a classic.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by nadafarms » Thu Mar 12, 2020 1:52 pm

At least they are finally doing a polysynth

cloning monosynths is not that impressive, lets see if they can make a classic poly without tuning issues

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Wracked with Guilt » Thu Mar 12, 2020 2:35 pm

(((EMP))) wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:42 am
beyourdog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:40 am
Analog Prophet wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:35 am
Prophet 600 is a great synth, no doubt, with the old classic vibe. The new Prophets are great as well, especial the P6, P12 and the Rev2. The new Pro 3 is promising. But still missing a modern P5, hope that’s on Behringer’s list - if not Uncle Dave get the brilliant idea of making a Prophet 5 (rev 2) ReIssue - it would sell even more than the original ever did.
The P600 is NOT a great synth, the P5 is, sound is good, the resonance is really musical too on a P5, it has its issues, but overall, the P5 is class.

The P600 was cheaply made, really plastic, with some annoying thimgs like shitty envelops and a very annoying stepping filter, pretty dark too....Funny thing to play, but really second rate...Let’s stop for a minute transforming any vintage piece of shit into some unique and rare thing, because it is not....Anyone remember ordering the P600 plastic membrane to the company who was selling the leftovers parts from Sequentials like 17 years ago??? Indid, and then I got ride of it, not worth it...
While I wouldn’t go this far, I do agree the P600 is mediocre and an odd choice as a clone? Just cause a synth is from the 80’s and “analog” doesn’t make it a classic.
The P600 may not be a Prophet 5 but it is certainly not a “piece of shit” or even mediocre for that matter.

Yes, it was cheaply made for sure - just like the Pro 1 - and yet there are plenty of both still around today in good condition. The membrane on mine needs a little extra pressure after 39 years, otherwise everything is flawless.

"You want luscious, deep string-type sounds? Get a secondhand 600. This synth stands side-by-side with the Prophet 5 and OBX, and head and shoulders above most other analogue keyboards"

(adopts Alan Partridge voice) Not my words but the words of Gordon Reid, writing in the August 1990 edition of Music Technology magazine. :guinness:

http://www.muzines.co.uk/articles/life-of-a-prophet/421

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Dave Peck » Thu Mar 12, 2020 5:36 pm

(((EMP))) wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:42 am
I do agree the P600 is mediocre and an odd choice as a clone? Just cause a synth is from the 80’s and “analog” doesn’t make it a classic.
Yeah, I'm more interested in new clones of vintage synths when manufacturers recreate more impressive and unobtainable vintage synths like the Korg PS3300, the Voyetra Eight, or the Matrix12. I think synths like the Deckard's Dream are a brilliant idea.

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by tobb » Thu Mar 12, 2020 6:11 pm

thee ghost ov n_phay wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 11:48 am
Never thought that the prophet 600 was all that special? I mean it was okay, but....

Seems like a weird choice for a new clone.
The LPF-chip in the P600 is somehow special because it has an compensated Q,if you turn up the Q there is no volume/bass drop unlike the P5's

It sounds similar to the CEM3328 chip

The great thing about that is when you make patches that uses the polymod together with Q up and closed filter give very nice result,impossible to recreate on a P5

The + side of the P5 is that you can do nice soft string sounds (boosting the Q = less bass) while on a P600 you have to use an external EQ otherwise there is always too much bass

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by AKMORSY » Thu Mar 12, 2020 7:19 pm

Wracked with Guilt wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 2:35 pm
(((EMP))) wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:42 am
beyourdog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 6:40 am
Analog Prophet wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 1:35 am
Prophet 600 is a great synth, no doubt, with the old classic vibe. The new Prophets are great as well, especial the P6, P12 and the Rev2. The new Pro 3 is promising. But still missing a modern P5, hope that’s on Behringer’s list - if not Uncle Dave get the brilliant idea of making a Prophet 5 (rev 2) ReIssue - it would sell even more than the original ever did.
The P600 is NOT a great synth, the P5 is, sound is good, the resonance is really musical too on a P5, it has its issues, but overall, the P5 is class.

The P600 was cheaply made, really plastic, with some annoying thimgs like shitty envelops and a very annoying stepping filter, pretty dark too....Funny thing to play, but really second rate...Let’s stop for a minute transforming any vintage piece of shit into some unique and rare thing, because it is not....Anyone remember ordering the P600 plastic membrane to the company who was selling the leftovers parts from Sequentials like 17 years ago??? Indid, and then I got ride of it, not worth it...
While I wouldn’t go this far, I do agree the P600 is mediocre and an odd choice as a clone? Just cause a synth is from the 80’s and “analog” doesn’t make it a classic.
The P600 may not be a Prophet 5 but it is certainly not a “piece of shit” or even mediocre for that matter.

Yes, it was cheaply made for sure - just like the Pro 1 - and yet there are plenty of both still around today in good condition. The membrane on mine needs a little extra pressure after 39 years, otherwise everything is flawless.

"You want luscious, deep string-type sounds? Get a secondhand 600. This synth stands side-by-side with the Prophet 5 and OBX, and head and shoulders above most other analogue keyboards"

(adopts Alan Partridge voice) Not my words but the words of Gordon Reid, writing in the August 1990 edition of Music Technology magazine. :guinness:

http://www.muzines.co.uk/articles/life-of-a-prophet/421

Totally agree with WWG. While it might be considered heresy, I actually like the strings on my P600 better than my P5 (this is not to diss the P5, which of course is great in so many ways).

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Re: Behringer Pro 800, Prophet 600 clone

Post by Bob Borries » Thu Mar 12, 2020 9:22 pm

DesolationBlvd wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:31 am
Bob Borries wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 3:37 pm
SSM2044 filters would sound better
SSM2044? No. That was never used in the classic Prophet series.
according to this link: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/CEM_and ... nthesizers
the Prophet-5 Rev 1 & 2 had 5x SSM2040 VCF's (some people say the Prophet 5 Rev 1 & 2 sounded better) The Rev 3 version switched to cheaper Curtis chips and sold more because of the price drop.
DesolationBlvd wrote:
Thu Mar 12, 2020 11:31 am
If they get this right (maybe add the missing Pulse Width in Poly-Mod destinations through a bit of menu diving?), I'll go for this over Prophet-6.
I didn't notice that the poly-mod section neglected pulse width, good observation. Defiantly want this.

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