Motas-6 synth

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n3wt15
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by n3wt15 » Thu Nov 05, 2020 3:44 am

This thing is sick sounding and im glad I found out about it before I started looking for a FR777 again haha

dykehouse
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by dykehouse » Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:26 am

Special thanks to you Pentajaja as well, all of your written words of praise, videos, and sound clips helped me make my decision as well! Thank you very much!

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Petajaja » Fri Nov 06, 2020 3:45 am

Thanks, I'm glad the demos and my endless raving about it helped haha! It's a crime in my eyes that this thing continues to go mostly unnoticed as it deserves so much more.

I'm probably going to be doing some more stuff with it soon that I'll share.
Check out my Motas-6 demos over at: https://soundcloud.com/retroreflector :love:

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Petajaja » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:03 am

Sharing this here over from GS:

"Hi, Jon here from Motas Electronics.

New firmware is now released, get it from https://www.motas-synth.uk/downloads.html

Polychaining is the biggest new feature, see the list below for full details of this update.
Please read the updated user guide for more info.

Enjoy!


CHANGE HISTORY LOG:
v06020116:
FEATURE: New polychaining of multiple Motas-6 units for polyphonic playing.
FEATURE: New intelligent MIDI OUT merge function, required by polychaining
FEATURE: New options to transmit patch and global settings on various pages (especially useful with polychaining).
FEATURE: New infra- and ultra-sonic modes for VCO2 and VCO3 primarily for use with phase modulation to allow carrier suppression.
FEATURE: New CV option to send MIDI CC codes
FEATURE: Changed portamento values to display time or rate instead of arbitrary units.
FEATURE: When patch is reset to default the parameter mappings now also reset.
FEATURE: Improved SysEx sending routines to lock-out other data when sending
FEATURE: New MIDI diagnostics display option to show last 16 events as HEX values.
FEATURE: LFO pitch now changes by 1 octave in pitch/note track mode when using encoder pushed.
FEATURE: Improved keypress handling on menus
FEATURE: Increased update and sending rate of CC mapping real-time control.
FEATURE: Added NRPN control and parameter mapping for portamento, note-off tracking, LFO sync MIDI and pitchwheel sensitivity.
FEATURE: Disabled sending of NRPN data when MIDI CC data is sent for a parameter in the parameter map.
BUG-FIX: Fixed error in mapping text display garbled.
BUG-FIX: Removed always sending MIDI CC from CV data.
BUG-FIX: Fixed some NRPN parameters being sent with the wrong codes.
BUG-FIX: Fixed calibration routine for noise source intensity reporting FAIL incorrectly."

Pretty huge update, excited to give that polychain stuff a go but there's also so much else in this update that I'm excited for :)
Check out my Motas-6 demos over at: https://soundcloud.com/retroreflector :love:

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indexofmetals
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by indexofmetals » Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:57 am

"New polychaining of multiple Motas-6 units for polyphonic playing."

can I please delete this from my memory

Petajaja
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Petajaja » Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:09 am

indexofmetals wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:57 am
"New polychaining of multiple Motas-6 units for polyphonic playing."

can I please delete this from my memory
haha tell me about it.. I'm already set on buying a third once I sell off some gear but something tells me that it wont be the last :doh:
Check out my Motas-6 demos over at: https://soundcloud.com/retroreflector :love:

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by grizzleb » Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:32 am

Lol I dunno what happens to people when they get one of these things but I'm considering getting rid of my pro 3 and joining the cult. I love my pro 3 but motas sounds like it has a bit more range. Need more sound examples though... Lots of the examples havent exactly been in my style but neither were the pro 3...


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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Petajaja » Thu Nov 12, 2020 10:13 am

grizzleb wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 9:32 am
Lol I dunno what happens to people when they get one of these things but I'm considering getting rid of my pro 3 and joining the cult. I love my pro 3 but motas sounds like it has a bit more range. Need more sound examples though... Lots of the examples havent exactly been in my style but neither were the pro 3...
Motas definitely has a lot more range, you have the dual resonant filters and all the PM stuff and probably a lot more but I've not looked at the Pro 3 at depth. The designers seem uninterested in adding features that don't line up with their vision as a performers synth so I think there'll always be places where it falls short compared to the Motas where you have full control over pretty much anything you could want in a synth.

I'd point you towards my demos but I'm guessing you've probably already heard them.. What is your style? I'm pretty sure the Motas could fit perfectly into any style but I think its sound tends towards vintage where the pro-3 is more modern.

haha and yeah Nelson Baboon, Jon adds more to this synth in a month than the big names add to their synths over the entire time they support them. I'm sure this wont be the last we'll see for the Motas either :mrgreen:
Check out my Motas-6 demos over at: https://soundcloud.com/retroreflector :love:

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indexofmetals
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by indexofmetals » Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:55 pm

Petajaja - I've been considering a second one since soon after I got mine last year and this update will make fighting that impulse even harder.

GrizzleB - the v word I'd use for the Motas-6 is versatile. It can do a lot and sometimes it takes a long time to get there.

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Petajaja » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:10 pm

indexofmetals wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 12:55 pm
Petajaja - I've been considering a second one since soon after I got mine last year and this update will make fighting that impulse even harder.

GrizzleB - the v word I'd use for the Motas-6 is versatile. It can do a lot and sometimes it takes a long time to get there.
I definitely don't think you'll regret it unless you're like me and end up wanting a third one!

It's definitely a versatile synth with its own very nice character but I also feel that due to how flexible it is, with things like gainstaging, you can somewhat closely approximate the characters of many other synths.

I actually find it very fast to program and it usually doesn't take me long at all to get where I want to go, the only thing that can take some time for me is setting up vector morphing patches that are pleasing or sometimes I'll stumble onto some particularly unique sound from how I've done the gainstaging on the synth and when I try to make this sound again, it takes me a little while to figure out what it was I did the last time.

Just about finished up with the days work, going to go give the polychain stuff a try soon :hyper:
Check out my Motas-6 demos over at: https://soundcloud.com/retroreflector :love:

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by grizzleb » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:31 pm

The stuff I like is more bubbling sizzling drexciya electro, spacey kosmische style and radiophonic workshop kind of stuff... Lots of the stuff I've heard has been more kind of rephlex idm stuff... Think that's all down to how it's programmed though that is all classic analog sound stuff

But yeah some of the wavetables have been growing on me a lot lately with the pro 3...hmmm

You guys have definitely been making a strong case though, just not heard anything that makes me dead sure I want to take the plunge

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Nelson Baboon
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Nelson Baboon » Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:42 pm

i've never bought a synth based primarily on demos i've heard.

i would never tell you to dump a synth that i've never used to buy one that i like.

even if you heard a demo that you really liked, how do you really know whether you will like the overall experience of working with it, and how easy you will find it to make sounds that you like.

there is always a great deal of uncertainty when it comes to the process of selling and expensive synth to buy another expensive synth.

i'd say only that the dave smith stuff are far more traditional in their approach to synthesis, and dsi/sequential is way more dedicated to churning out one synth after another, and then not updating them much. i can testify to Jon's dedication, and the depth of the instrument. I really don't even want to try to convince you that it will work for you more than the pro3.

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Petajaja » Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:11 pm

grizzleb wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:31 pm
The stuff I like is more bubbling sizzling drexciya electro, spacey kosmische style and radiophonic workshop kind of stuff... Lots of the stuff I've heard has been more kind of rephlex idm stuff... Think that's all down to how it's programmed though that is all classic analog sound stuff

But yeah some of the wavetables have been growing on me a lot lately with the pro 3...hmmm

You guys have definitely been making a strong case though, just not heard anything that makes me dead sure I want to take the plunge
I agree with Nelson Baboon's approach here in not trying to convince you and just encouraging you to make your own mind up but a the same time I can't shut up about this because I am just infinitely enthusiastic about how great a synth it is.

I can't speak against the Pro-3 really and the idea of one sounding better than the other is of course entirely subjective.. I can say that there's been a few now owners of the Motas who sold their Pro-3 to fund it and were very happy with that decision. The Motas doesn't have the wavetable stuff so if that's a big thing for you then of course that'll play heavily into which one's the better synth for you.

The Motas nails the radiophonic workshop vibe perfectly imo.. I like drexciyas' work but have never got massively into them (I'm sure I would but just keeps not happening) if you've got any links to some examples of the kinds of patches that you'd like to hear, I'll see what I can do next time I get round to doing some recordings of the Motas. I've asked a lot in the past, what people would like to hear but don't really get much more of a response than Bass, leads, pads etc which really doesn't help me much as it then always ends up being the kind of bass / lead / pads I'd choose to make. I quite like the challenge of trying to emulate sounds with the Motas so if there's anything you'd like to hear, don't hesitate to ask!


I only had a brief play around with the new firmware this evening but I really enjoyed it, hearing the overlapping release from the two Motas was incredible.. a polysynth made from these voices would be up there with the best I think.
Check out my Motas-6 demos over at: https://soundcloud.com/retroreflector :love:

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Nelson Baboon
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Nelson Baboon » Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:34 pm

Edit....

was frustrated and didn't think that the polychain setup was working.

but it does seem to be (superficially).

i think that the instructions could be a bit better, and the update instructions really should remind users that the settings on the motas need to be changed to use the editor successfully.

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Nelson Baboon
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Nelson Baboon » Thu Nov 12, 2020 8:53 pm

nah - i'm missing something. i am able to transmit the patch from #1 to #2, but sending sequenced midi to #1 only plays #1, only every other note, and sometimes not playing at all (hah - but i may have a probability setting on the sequencer). but #2 isn't playing at all. isn't that part of the idea. Shit.

do i need to send midi to #2 also? that's not part of the poly chain concept though? shouldn't i just need to send midi to #1? Now it's not playing at all.

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MotasSynth
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by MotasSynth » Fri Nov 13, 2020 3:01 am

Hi, Jon here from Motas Electronics.

To update the Motas-6 firmware the unit has to have MIDI input SysEx enabled (since the new firmware is sent via SysEx MIDI) and allow updates on. See section 17.13 and 17.15 of the user guide. I will update the software guide with more details on this as a priority.

To use the polychain the first unit in the chain (in a chain of 2) needs to have MIDI out set to THRU or THRU+ALL (see section 17.13 of the user guide v1.27) in order that your MIDI controller data is relayed to the 2nd unit. In the new mode THRU+ALL any MIDI generated from the 1st unit is intelligently merged with the incoming data which allows editing parameters on the first to be sent to the 2nd to allow operating the multiples synths 'as one' with the same sound settings at all times. Also loading patches on the first can be sent to the 2nd in this mode. Of course the 2nd unit needs to have its MIDI In set appropriately for this to work (see section 17.13 again), namely set to NRPN+SYSEX. Another option is to have the Motas-6 units not actually in a chain but individually sent the MIDI data from your controller using e.g. an external MIDI splitter/multiple THRU unit, or PC software and individual USB connections. In this case the possibility to edit parameters on the first unit being sent to the second is probably lost (depending on your setup of this) but the units will still play polyphonically as the 'polychain' implementation is not a 'note-stealing' algorithm but a much more comprehensive round-robin algorithm that does not require the units actually in a physical chain...

I apologise if the instructions are unclear or sparse. I have started work on a new 'How To...' guide to compliment the existing user guide to try to make things easier in future. I know that due to the complexity and depth of Motas-6 sometimes it is hard to remember how to use every feature! The reason for the number of options and flexibility is that I don't like to restrict the possible ways Motas-6 could be used, but the downside is the potential for confusion in setting things up.

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Nelson Baboon
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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Nelson Baboon » Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:11 am

thanks, Jon. I did have the update solved but was suggesting that the midi settings be mentioned in the update instructions.

As far as the poly chaining - YES. obviously my symptoms were consistent with everything being set up correctly except for the midi out on the first unit in the series. While yes - this is a rtfm manual moment, where the poor user missed this one thing, i think that in a complicated device like this it helps to have a little redundancy in the manual. I can't argue too strongly here (OBVIOUSLY I missed this, and it mentions that it is useful), and (to disparage my brain further) logically what I was missing in my plaintive descriptions was the midi being passed "thru" from the first device to the second.

can't wait to make this one tweak and see how it works with the units set up correctly.

I do want to say that the manual is actually very clear and well written. But there is just so much in there.....

well, all this coming from a dumb, embarrassed user.

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by MotasSynth » Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:08 am

Nelson Baboon wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:11 am
thanks, Jon. I did have the update solved but was suggesting that the midi settings be mentioned in the update instructions.

As far as the poly chaining - YES. obviously my symptoms were consistent with everything being set up correctly except for the midi out on the first unit in the series. While yes - this is a rtfm manual moment, where the poor user missed this one thing, i think that in a complicated device like this it helps to have a little redundancy in the manual. I can't argue too strongly here (OBVIOUSLY I missed this, and it mentions that it is useful), and (to disparage my brain further) logically what I was missing in my plaintive descriptions was the midi being passed "thru" from the first device to the second.

can't wait to make this one tweak and see how it works with the units set up correctly.

I do want to say that the manual is actually very clear and well written. But there is just so much in there.....

well, all this coming from a dumb, embarrassed user.
No problem ;)
I know that the user guide, even though it runs to around 64 (dense) pages, might only mention something quite significant in a one-liner which is easy to miss. I plan to flesh out how to achieve certain things into the "How To..." guide.

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by grizzleb » Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:22 am

Have you got any plans to get a demo unit around some of these YouTube people? Seems like they do a lot of work in exposing people to new products and I could do with hearing this

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by grizzleb » Fri Nov 13, 2020 10:29 am

Petajaja wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 7:11 pm
grizzleb wrote:
Thu Nov 12, 2020 6:31 pm
The stuff I like is more bubbling sizzling drexciya electro, spacey kosmische style and radiophonic workshop kind of stuff... Lots of the stuff I've heard has been more kind of rephlex idm stuff... Think that's all down to how it's programmed though that is all classic analog sound stuff

But yeah some of the wavetables have been growing on me a lot lately with the pro 3...hmmm

You guys have definitely been making a strong case though, just not heard anything that makes me dead sure I want to take the plunge
I agree with Nelson Baboon's approach here in not trying to convince you and just encouraging you to make your own mind up but a the same time I can't shut up about this because I am just infinitely enthusiastic about how great a synth it is.

I can't speak against the Pro-3 really and the idea of one sounding better than the other is of course entirely subjective.. I can say that there's been a few now owners of the Motas who sold their Pro-3 to fund it and were very happy with that decision. The Motas doesn't have the wavetable stuff so if that's a big thing for you then of course that'll play heavily into which one's the better synth for you.

The Motas nails the radiophonic workshop vibe perfectly imo.. I like drexciyas' work but have never got massively into them (I'm sure I would but just keeps not happening) if you've got any links to some examples of the kinds of patches that you'd like to hear, I'll see what I can do next time I get round to doing some recordings of the Motas. I've asked a lot in the past, what people would like to hear but don't really get much more of a response than Bass, leads, pads etc which really doesn't help me much as it then always ends up being the kind of bass / lead / pads I'd choose to make. I quite like the challenge of trying to emulate sounds with the Motas so if there's anything you'd like to hear, don't hesitate to ask!


I only had a brief play around with the new firmware this evening but I really enjoyed it, hearing the overlapping release from the two Motas was incredible.. a polysynth made from these voices would be up there with the best I think.
That's very kind of you, please don't go to any trouble on my account though.



And

Might be good examples of the drexciya sound I'm looking for

Here is a patch I made in the Pro 3 which shows some of the almost guitar songs you can get with it

https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/2WGM

But really don't do this on my account!

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by grizzleb » Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:04 am

Double post

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by Petajaja » Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:28 am

The Motas can definitely do these kinds of sounds, not entirely sure what's going on in the second one but it sounds like more than 1 patch with the main part of it being FM'd maybe?

I probably wont end up exactly recreating them but I did have a plan for some similar kind of stuff in one of the next videos I do so I'll be sure to share when that's ready.

Nice patch on the Pro-3 is that using wavetables?

I think it's possible to pull off most sounds in the Motas-6, I think the main thing is to study the sound at its core to hear where it's one you like because if it is then I don't think you'll find anything else to not like about the synth.
Check out my Motas-6 demos over at: https://soundcloud.com/retroreflector :love:

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by grizzleb » Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:30 am

That's actually just the analog oscillators through the feedback I think, don't think there's any digital sound sources...

Some good thoughts to be going on with... Now I just need to listen to more samples if I can find them...

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Re: Motas-6 synth

Post by MotasSynth » Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:47 am

In case anyone didn't know already here are some samples from Motas-6 I put together:
https://www.motas-synth.uk/patchBank4.html
https://www.motas-synth.uk/samples.html

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