New gear from Behringer, what would you like to see happen.?

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Fiddlestickz
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New gear from Behringer, what would you like to see happen.?

Post by Fiddlestickz » Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:01 am

I hear Behringer is going to go all out and build all sorts of great gear for us all at affordable prices, imagine Moogs and Oberheims etc for a fraction of the cost, as long as the sound is close this is a serious win for us all no..?

I'm keen to see what they can do with modular and drum machines, the Deepmind is huge success I can't wait to see what they have up their sleeve..

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Post by anselmi » Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:33 am

I´d like to see him giving back the Oberheim name and logo to Tom...then go to create something new, instead of continue stealing other´s people ideas

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Post by TifaretMusic » Wed Mar 01, 2017 3:51 pm

anselmi wrote:I´d like to see him giving back the Oberheim name and logo to Tom..
I thought it was Gibson that owned that?
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Re: New gear from Behringer, what would you like to see happ

Post by Man-In-A-Suitcase » Wed Mar 01, 2017 4:05 pm

Fiddlestickz wrote:I hear Behringer is going to go all out and build all sorts of great gear for us all at affordable prices
yes i'm sure a 1K synth clone is affordable to the everyday musician out there.

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Re: New gear from Behringer, what would you like to see happ

Post by AdamJay » Wed Mar 01, 2017 4:18 pm

Fiddlestickz wrote:imagine Moogs and Oberheims etc for a fraction of the cost, as long as the sound is close this is a serious win for us all no..?
More will lose than win in a race to the bottom.

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Post by Fiddlestickz » Wed Mar 01, 2017 6:30 pm

You're all so negative all the time, try to be positive it works wonders..

I think that more cheaper good quality gear accessible to more younger people who ordinarily couldn't afford anything is a great thing for the industry and music in general.

Think of all those kids and young people who will now be able to change a stagnate industry, create new genres and styles, tip the whole scene on it's head.

We don't have exclusive rights to this stuff, it's for everyone from all around the world, rich or dirt poor to be able to make music, these new instruments are going to make it totally accessible to everyone now, this negative snobby synth hierarchy is totally boring and reeks of elitism.

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Post by anselmi » Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:42 pm

Fiddlestickz wrote:You're all so negative all the time, try to be positive it works wonders..

I think that more cheaper good quality gear accessible to more younger people who ordinarily couldn't afford anything is a great thing for the industry and music in general.
yeah, the "democratization" speech...so convenient for a billion dollar company that spent the last 15 years cloning every single pedal from other companies...

no sir, I don´t want to eat this shit...this are just a mere demagogic argument for make money from other´s people ideas

I preffer dave smith´s approach all the way, just making great stuff by himself and helping people like tom oberheim to make money the most honorable way: by team up and make great stuff together

or the people at moog, bringing back the model D to life in the most venerable way...this companies deserve my respect and money
Think of all those kids and young people who will now be able to change a stagnate industry, create new genres and styles, tip the whole scene on it's head.
BIG changes was made by people with great ideas, lot of limitations, and old gear...use limitations as a driver for innovation...buying a new instrument does not necessarily make you more creative
We don't have exclusive rights to this stuff, it's for everyone from all around the world, rich or dirt poor to be able to make music, these new instruments are going to make it totally accessible to everyone now, this negative snobby synth hierarchy is totally boring and reeks of elitism.
snobby my ass...you don´t know me, so better you just change the way you write about other people´s opinion

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Post by anselmi » Wed Mar 01, 2017 11:54 pm

TifaretMusic wrote:
anselmi wrote:I´d like to see him giving back the Oberheim name and logo to Tom..
I thought it was Gibson that owned that?

from matrixsynth:
it appears Music Group IP, which Behringer falls under, made logo and trademark grabs for Oberheim

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Post by IR » Thu Mar 02, 2017 6:52 am

I use their mixers and some of their effects, great stuff.

Do I really care if they make synths and drum machines? Not really, the market is already saturated and there's is so much great stuff available already, a lot of it at affordable prices.

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Post by Astronaut FX » Thu Mar 02, 2017 9:33 am

I made the following post at GS, but since it's relevant to this discussion, I feel it's appropriate to add here as well...

I find it really interesting that so many musicians won't give Behringer a break, and allow them to reinvent themselves, especially since Behringer is essentially taking the same path toward improvement that most musicians take! Bear with me for a moment to elaborate...

So most musicians start off awful. Most of our first band attempts were horrible at best. We probably started off playing covers, badly. In other words, poor quality copies of other people's stuff. But with some time and experience, we started sharpening our chops. We might even have moved on to other bands, or maybe replaced band members who didn't grow at the same pace we did. In other words, we improved, and we associated with others whose talents also improved. Then maybe we moved on to start writing our own music, and maybe at first it wasn't so great. But again, with a little persistence, we got better at originals. Yes, our originals were maybe a bit derivative of our influences, but no one really gets too worked up about that. Before you know it, we're creating our own music, and other people actually want to hear it.

Isn't this the exact path that Behringer has taken? They started off making cheap, affordable gear. In many cases, that gear was unabashedly cheaper (possibly lower quality) copies of other gear. But they learned as they went, and improved over time. Then came some targeted acquisitions, and they began to supplement their team with outside talent. Fast forward to recent times, and with the release of the X32 and now the DM12, they're putting out higher quality, more original gear. Yes, the DM12 started as a nod to the JUNO series, but is still very much it's own thing. No more a knock off than any of our original music.

Again, a path very similar to the tried and true, and nearly universally respected paths that many, many musicians themselves take, but so many seem unable to see the parallel, and give Behringer a second look. Anyway, not trying to change any minds, or convert anyone, just wanted to draw what I saw as an interesting parallel.
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Post by Helmey » Thu Mar 02, 2017 4:42 pm

I'd compare Behringer to a Chinese version of Alesis. Good value for the money except that Alesis invented a lot of new technology rather than borrowing it from everyone else. It was their downfall - the Paris system, etc. They also did it without the benefit of modern contract manufacturing. Uli perfected it. Others have followed, and I don't see Behringer creating some new low-cost analog synth niche any more than Casio or Studiologic or Arturia or.... I've owned Behringer products but never loved the experience. I'll feel better about the company when Behringer invents something truly new and groundbreaking, like the ADAT optical port. Right now it's just cheap knockoffs and repackaged designs.

Behringer makes some nice stuff, but are synths their future? Will they make something new and different, or just continue to rip off old ideas with new cheap packaging? I guess we'll have to wait and see...it's like Mackie getting into instruments. The thought of an Oberheim 'by Behringer' makes me gag even more than Gibson/Viscount did. :zombie:

And this elitism thing - what pitiable garbage! it's never been better than it is right now and nobody is waiting for cheap analog synths to make music. (how cheap do they have to get anyway?) I think Teenage Engineering covered that already. IMO, 'Snobby' is overlooking a company's bad behavior and ethics to get what you want.
Last edited by Helmey on Thu Mar 02, 2017 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by mamonu » Thu Mar 02, 2017 4:49 pm

The thought of an Oberheim 'by Berhinger' makes me gag even more than Gibson/Viscount did.

as an owner of a Xpander, a previous owner of a OB8 and Matrix1000 i am between throwing up a little in my mouth and being really angry :mad:


Be^&*hringer can suck donkey balls if they do that. The same goes for that blue monstrosity the Viscount OB12. :deadbanana:

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Post by DiscoDevil » Thu Mar 02, 2017 4:52 pm

The comparison to early cover bands doesn't work because the cover bands aren't stealing the songs and trying to sell them as their own right next to the original in the same retail space for half the price.

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Post by Kaput » Thu Mar 02, 2017 5:00 pm

That Viscount OB12 thing was heinous. I remember it. :eek:

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Post by Fiddlestickz » Thu Mar 02, 2017 6:33 pm

errr the Deepmind is an original product..

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Post by Fiddlestickz » Thu Mar 02, 2017 6:41 pm

anselmi wrote:
Fiddlestickz wrote:You're all so negative all the time, try to be positive it works wonders..

I think that more cheaper good quality gear accessible to more younger people who ordinarily couldn't afford anything is a great thing for the industry and music in general.
yeah, the "democratization" speech...so convenient for a billion dollar company that spent the last 15 years cloning every single pedal from other companies...

no sir, I don´t want to eat this shit...this are just a mere demagogic argument for make money from other´s people ideas

I preffer dave smith´s approach all the way, just making great stuff by himself and helping people like tom oberheim to make money the most honorable way: by team up and make great stuff together

or the people at moog, bringing back the model D to life in the most venerable way...this companies deserve my respect and money
Think of all those kids and young people who will now be able to change a stagnate industry, create new genres and styles, tip the whole scene on it's head.
BIG changes was made by people with great ideas, lot of limitations, and old gear...use limitations as a driver for innovation...buying a new instrument does not necessarily make you more creative
We don't have exclusive rights to this stuff, it's for everyone from all around the world, rich or dirt poor to be able to make music, these new instruments are going to make it totally accessible to everyone now, this negative snobby synth hierarchy is totally boring and reeks of elitism.
snobby my ass...you don´t know me, so better you just change the way you write about other people´s opinion
the very nature of modular is to use clones of original circuits, filters, vca's, oscillators etc etc..

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Post by Huba-Swift » Thu Mar 02, 2017 6:57 pm

Fiddlestickz wrote:errr the Deepmind is an original product..
Well, it was based on the Juno. I do think often times companies use another product or idea as a building block to build a better product. This shouldn't be considered as copying, just innovating. That's what Behringer did with the Deepmind 12 and I thought it turned out very well and I'm excited to see them do more of it. If a company were to straight up copy someone else, and benefit off of the other companies ideas, then I'd have a problem with it. Concerning smaller businesses, there will always be people that will still prefer to get the more expensive boutique products, and smaller companies will still have a place because they're able to take risks and try out crazy ideas that in many cases larger companies would not do. All Behringer is doing by releasing cheaper products is allowing people with less income get into synthesis, or perhaps more accurately, allowing people who are not willing to spends a lot on synthesizers, get into synthesis.

Edit: My biggest worry is that if synthesizers will get so cheap, many of us won't have an excuse to DIY anymore.

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Post by anselmi » Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:19 pm

Fiddlestickz wrote:the very nature of modular is to use clones of original circuits, filters, vca's, oscillators etc etc..
you can´t compare modular VERY small companies with a massive one like Behringer...most modular developers barely covers the costs of components and time inverted in their products

also, something bigger like Moog is small and have very artisan-like methods of manufacturing of stuff like the new Model D

I can support Roman from Sputnikmodular making a CS-80-inspired synth...why? because this guy is not a massive company and Yamaha is...also, Yamaha will never make something like this because the high cost-benefit ratio...then this is a real unique opportunity of get such a synth, but I don`t feel as comfortable with Roman still making his 208r while BEMI is manufacturing the new Easel

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Post by DiscoDevil » Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:31 pm

Reproducing circuits and modules that haven't been in production for 30 years is different than taking a product off the shelf, reverse engineering it (or worse), creating a clone and selling it side by side with the product you cloned for half the price at Guitar Center. Perhaps they've changed these days and in all honesty, I actually use a few of their original products but can't help but feel like the world could kind of do without them as a company.

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Post by h4ndcrafted » Thu Mar 02, 2017 8:38 pm

Well an Arp2600 obviously. Not bothered about TR machines , the world has enough.

Personally I'd like to see some more of the more sort after esoteric synths, Putney etc.

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Post by kwaidan » Thu Mar 02, 2017 11:28 pm

After reading about Berhinger Music City in China, I would never consider buying his products.

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Post by DMR » Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:02 am

The Deepmind is inexpensive for what is is, a 12-voice analog synth, but I'm not sure i'd consider it an inexpensive item generally for a young person getting into music. I think laptops and software have had mad a much larger impact on the democratization of music making and the creation of new genres than the Deepmind will.

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Post by Pase » Fri Mar 03, 2017 1:41 am

DMR wrote:The Deepmind is inexpensive for what is is, a 12-voice analog synth, but I'm not sure i'd consider it an inexpensive item generally for a young person getting into music. I think laptops and software have had mad a much larger impact on the democratization of music making and the creation of new genres than the Deepmind will.
:agree:

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Post by hex » Fri Mar 03, 2017 12:04 pm

A Deepmind desktop would be an insta-buy for me.

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Post by anselmi » Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:22 am

kwaidan wrote:After reading about Berhinger Music City in China, I would never consider buying his products.

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yep...it isn´t hard to imagine the kind of company it is and why their products costs half the price of, say, DSI

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