processing a moog voyager to get more model d sound

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processing a moog voyager to get more model d sound

Post by smitty.west » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:01 pm

so a couple of cool synths came up for sale locally at some pretty great prices.
one was a moog source (near mint w/ new battery) @ $1300 and the other was a mint voyager @ $1500. i was 100% set on the source as it got a more raw and in-your-face vintage sound that i found closer to my friends model d which is the source of all my moog lust, but then i thought about it and decided to go for the voyager, which is priced especially well i think. i pick it up thursday evening and while part of is thinking i should of gone with the source purely for tone, the other part is already wondering of ways to get the voyager closer to that famous vintage moog tone. there's this beautiful sizzling (but very pleasant) top end to the minimoog and source that i adore. overall i find it to be a more-- pardon the overused adjective-- organic sounding instrument. i've previously compared my friends model d to his voyager and it was a pretty drastic difference. i'm not saying the voyager's sound is bad-- wouldn't be getting it if that was the case, regardless of price--, but i definitely find the d's closer to my liking. wondering if there's any specific pieces of gear you guys recommend i could process it with to get me closer. read somewhere i can route out to an external oscillator and then back in which might get me closer. any tips/tricks? appreciate any/all feedback! part of the reason i skipped out on the source is also that i plan to track down a studio electronics midimoog/midimini which will give me that classic model d sound. would of gone the original model d route, but afraid of it crapping out- my friends is in the shop more than it is in use.

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Post by slow_riot » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:19 pm

The Voyager has *huge* compromises to the signal path to achieve dynamic digital control, there are around 30 high distortion VCAs throughout the audio circuitry. I think it's a very good synth but no amount of post processing will make it into something that it is not.

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Post by The Real MC » Tue Aug 25, 2015 11:25 pm

You should had went for the Source, as that is the board closest to that "sizzle" of the model D.

I have both Voyager and model D which is retrofitted with the Lintronics MIDI interface. One night I decided to run the mixer out of the Voyager into the external input of the model D, and I got that "sizzle" from the Voyager. The big difference is the VCA not the VCF - Voyager uses high fidelity VCAs while model D VCA is the best technology of its time yet low fidelity and distorted.
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Post by digitalganesha » Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:55 am

It actually took me quite a while to grow to adore my Voyager. These days - I absolutely love it and its one of my main go-to synths. The amount of performance control thanks to the pot mapping and tasteful use of the x,y pad along with the aftertouch make it pretty damn expressive. I got the Sub37 and am forcing myself to not compare it tonally to the Voyager. In my opinion - the sound of the Voyager kills every Phatty I have owned including the Sub37. Yes you're not going to get the overgain/saturation from the Voyagers mixer as you will the Mini's CP3 derived one, but there are sweetspots and a extremely simple trick to completely get the growl into the Voyager. Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.

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Post by digitalganesha » Wed Aug 26, 2015 2:46 am

https://soundcloud.com/digitalganesha/m ... er-wave-cv

Here's some examples. First you hear the patch without any overload, then the patch with it. The amounts vary from patch to patch but I do have at least one heavy feedback one in there I believe.

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Post by dopefiend » Wed Aug 26, 2015 7:09 am

Very nice!

Another nice way to give it more gowl and keeping it "in the family" is with a MF 104 delay, cranking up the distortion in it. Sounds absolutely monstrous! :goo:

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Post by smitty.west » Wed Aug 26, 2015 11:06 am

digitalganesha wrote:It actually took me quite a while to grow to adore my Voyager. These days - I absolutely love it and its one of my main go-to synths. The amount of performance control thanks to the pot mapping and tasteful use of the x,y pad along with the aftertouch make it pretty damn expressive. I got the Sub37 and am forcing myself to not compare it tonally to the Voyager. In my opinion - the sound of the Voyager kills every Phatty I have owned including the Sub37. Yes you're not going to get the overgain/saturation from the Voyagers mixer as you will the Mini's CP3 derived one, but there are sweetspots and a extremely simple trick to completely get the growl into the Voyager. Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.
Incredible advice; just what I was looking for!
Noob question (keep in mind I just pick up the V tomorrow):
if I wanted to constantly run the Voya using this "trick" (as in, I want to have this applied to each sound), is saving within a patch necessary?
I don't plan to use patches/presets much and will mainly manually change the sound each time. Part of the reason I wanted an Old School.

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Post by 3001 » Wed Aug 26, 2015 11:17 am

I hear if you bake the voyager in the oven it will sound like a model D! :goo:
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Post by digitalganesha » Wed Aug 26, 2015 1:24 pm

smitty.west wrote:
digitalganesha wrote:It actually took me quite a while to grow to adore my Voyager. These days - I absolutely love it and its one of my main go-to synths. The amount of performance control thanks to the pot mapping and tasteful use of the x,y pad along with the aftertouch make it pretty damn expressive. I got the Sub37 and am forcing myself to not compare it tonally to the Voyager. In my opinion - the sound of the Voyager kills every Phatty I have owned including the Sub37. Yes you're not going to get the overgain/saturation from the Voyagers mixer as you will the Mini's CP3 derived one, but there are sweetspots and a extremely simple trick to completely get the growl into the Voyager. Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.
Incredible advice; just what I was looking for!
Noob question (keep in mind I just pick up the V tomorrow):
if I wanted to constantly run the Voya using this "trick" (as in, I want to have this applied to each sound), is saving within a patch necessary?
I don't plan to use patches/presets much and will mainly manually change the sound each time. Part of the reason I wanted an Old School.
No you don't have to use the save headphone parameter at all to use this technique. I just enjoy the fact that it is savable.

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Post by davydka » Thu Aug 27, 2015 11:18 am

I got to play my voyager next to a model d once. They both sounded great! Biggest difference was the adsr times on the two.

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Post by dude » Thu Aug 27, 2015 9:04 pm

i happened to have just bought a source. it is amazing. i cannot go for modern moog sound, well i can but just not when i am seeking old moog tone. everything does have its place but source is what has been missing from my life. moog. it'll do you right if it is in good shape.

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Post by tdel » Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:00 pm

Honestly, I sold my Voyager and bought a Micromac in its place for exactly this reason. A thing to consider, perhaps.

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Post by ablearcher » Wed Sep 02, 2015 10:47 pm

I think you just need to patch it like a minimoog.

I worked in a vintage synth store when the voyager came out and while I didn't like it as much at first, when we put them side by side and made a conscious effort to patch them the same it sounded the same to me... :despair:

So yeah... You bought the right thing, just play with it instead of buying more things. No missing "mojo."

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Post by digitalganesha » Thu Sep 03, 2015 11:36 pm

It's the dirt in the mini that people dig. Lower tolerance components sound great when pushed. That's why my little patch to overload the mixer through the wave CV in helps so much. It helps drive the mixer headroom to it's limit.

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Post by wsy » Fri Sep 04, 2015 5:30 am

the "headphone out to mixer in" is a well-deserved trick.

I believe that the Arturia MiniBrute "brute factor" knob does exactly that (hardwired) - it even says so in the manual.

Go do it. Make the knob useful. :)

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Post by syzygywell » Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:28 pm

digitalganesha wrote:It actually took me quite a while to grow to adore my Voyager. These days - I absolutely love it and its one of my main go-to synths. The amount of performance control thanks to the pot mapping and tasteful use of the x,y pad along with the aftertouch make it pretty damn expressive. I got the Sub37 and am forcing myself to not compare it tonally to the Voyager. In my opinion - the sound of the Voyager kills every Phatty I have owned including the Sub37. Yes you're not going to get the overgain/saturation from the Voyagers mixer as you will the Mini's CP3 derived one, but there are sweetspots and a extremely simple trick to completely get the growl into the Voyager. Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.
Great I'm gonna try it.. and yes please post some sound samples. Has anyone heard of using the BBE Sonic stomp in the signal path? I read about it recently in the Voyager forum.
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Post by digitalganesha » Sat Sep 12, 2015 2:01 am

See the posts above for sounds.

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Post by Thesoft » Sat Sep 12, 2015 2:17 am

Try taking the output of the voyager into a mutable instruments shelves and sending the voyagers pitch cv to the shelves master CV. You'll able to adjust the waveform's spectrum to sizzle a more.

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Post by Liddlepud » Sat Sep 12, 2015 3:46 am

syzygywell wrote:Has anyone heard of using the BBE Sonic stomp in the signal path? I read about it recently in the Voyager forum.
I have one permanently patched in sitting in the tray behind the upright panel and I forget it's there . I don't have a model D to compare it to but it adds a bit more bite to the sound.

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Post by Liddlepud » Sat Sep 12, 2015 3:50 am

3001 wrote:I hear if you bake the voyager in the oven it will sound like a model D! :goo:
I heard the voyager shrinks when it's been in the oven and that's how they make the little fridge magnets they sell on e-bay.

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Post by namshub » Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:50 pm

digitalganesha wrote:Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.
Crikey!! Awesome... Great tip:::)))))

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Post by wsy » Sun Sep 20, 2015 6:10 pm

namshub wrote:
digitalganesha wrote:Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.
Crikey!! Awesome... Great tip:::)))))
I *think* you mean the Mixer External input, not the Wave CV input.... but hey, whatever works!

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Post by digitalganesha » Sun Sep 20, 2015 6:54 pm

wsy wrote:
namshub wrote:
digitalganesha wrote:Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.
Crikey!! Awesome... Great tip:::)))))
I *think* you mean the Mixer External input, not the Wave CV input.... but hey, whatever works! - Bill
Not at all, WAVE CV input is it. You can use the External in, but that doesn't cut it like the Wave IN does. You could also patch into the Filter CV in which sounds similar but more FM-ish.

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Post by syzygywell » Sun Sep 20, 2015 10:55 pm

digitalganesha wrote:
wsy wrote:
namshub wrote:
digitalganesha wrote:Take a TRS cable (make sure its TRS) and patch the headphone out into the WAVE CV input. Set the headphone volume to be stored within a patch when saved and presto - savable mixer feedback/overdrive. This completely changed the Voyager for me. Now it's a bastard. And yes.... it is totally safe to do this - headphone into WAVE CV with a TRS, gotta be a TRS to properly ground and ensure you are not going to blow a component. I've been doing this for years and not one single issue has ever occurred. I can post some sound examples of how awesome this adds to the sonic character, if you would like.
Crikey!! Awesome... Great tip:::)))))
I *think* you mean the Mixer External input, not the Wave CV input.... but hey, whatever works! - Bill
Not at all, WAVE CV input is it. You can use the External in, but that doesn't cut it like the Wave IN does. You could also patch into the Filter CV in which sounds similar but more FM-ish.
As well my understanding was to NOT run the headphone out into the Mixer in but use one of the stereo outs into the mixer.. This is from MOOG directly and was posted on several forums due to people wanting to overdrive the voyager. But this I definitely will try.
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Post by digitalganesha » Mon Sep 21, 2015 10:48 pm

My idea for this came from a Moog tech. The whole thing to remember is that a TRS cable is to be used running from the headphone out. Not using a TRS cable can lead to potential damage due to the high output of the headphone out.

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