Model 416 Easel Breakout-Box [preliminary interest check]

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gddfp
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Post by gddfp » Tue Dec 29, 2015 7:57 pm

Sonic boom wrote:
gddfp wrote:
Sonic boom wrote:
gddfp wrote:
astroschnautzer wrote:One question: Will this work with 208r v2?
If the v2's Program Card slot is 100% compatible with BEMI's, then yes it will.
(I've heard it is; but I believe the ModOsc Range Switch patch point is missing on v2, which is not a problem)

_g
Papz expander card has the MO range switch & it works fine with the Rev2 .
The complex oscillator range is whats missing i believe .
No Range switch on my CO. :hihi:
Perhaps it's the Polarity switch you're referring to? Which, BTW, is also missing as a BEMI patch point. (would've been way cool to have, tho)

But I'm happy to hear the Rev2 is 100% compatible with the BEMI.

_g
Nope . Its the MO range switch , like i said .....

If you look , it was in response to a rev 2 question quoted above it ...
Dunno about BEMI , but in response to that rev 2 question , i'll confirm that a MO range switch is possible .....
Not quite sure why you mention the CO ......
I mentioned the CO, because you said above:
The complex oscillator range is whats missing i believe .
There is no CMPLX Range switch on my Easel. :-)

_g

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gddfp
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Post by gddfp » Tue Dec 29, 2015 8:12 pm

Sonic boom wrote:Say Guy
Did you say you've been busy playing shows with the BOB ?
Under what name ?
Any demos of 'everything in your studio' synced to the 208+bob ??
"Busy" wasn't perhaps the right expression for the few gigs I did... :mrgreen:
I'm still waiting for some videos apparently made during those (one year and counting).
I've now [temporarily?] stopped making music and performing. This gives me more time to work on the Expander.

I'll try to make some dedicated videos once the 416 PCB's are fully working and I've got a proto jig running... Right now my test bench looks like chaos.

There's big changes ahead for the Expander board, so things might take a wee bit longer. But I'm moving forward steadily, so please be patient.

_g

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Post by lamouette/rck » Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:52 am

Interrested, PCB+PANEL+(KIT)
Setup is never done.

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Post by Neovintage » Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:53 am

Sonic boom wrote: If you look , it was in response to a rev 2 question quoted above it ...
Dunno about BEMI , but in response to that rev 2 question , i'll confirm that a MO range switch is possible .....
Where is that possible?
You could add a mod to switch between High and Low but if you want it under CV you will also need to create the circuit. This is not on the card.
gddfp wrote: There's big changes ahead for the Expander board, so things might take a wee bit longer. But I'm moving forward steadily, so please be patient.
Could you please add a 2-step switch and LEDs for pulse outputs?

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sb
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Post by sb » Wed Dec 30, 2015 3:12 am

+1. I'd definitely buy the 'full' version.

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Post by papaZooZoo » Wed Dec 30, 2015 4:51 am

Very interested PCB and panel

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Post by mich » Wed Dec 30, 2015 7:20 am

interested

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Post by Sonic boom » Wed Dec 30, 2015 9:39 am

gddfp wrote:
Sonic boom wrote:
gddfp wrote:
Sonic boom wrote:
gddfp wrote:
astroschnautzer wrote:One question: Will this work with 208r v2?
If the v2's Program Card slot is 100% compatible with BEMI's, then yes it will.
(I've heard it is; but I believe the ModOsc Range Switch patch point is missing on v2, which is not a problem)

_g
Papz expander card has the MO range switch & it works fine with the Rev2 .
The complex oscillator range is whats missing i believe .
No Range switch on my CO. :hihi:
Perhaps it's the Polarity switch you're referring to? Which, BTW, is also missing as a BEMI patch point. (would've been way cool to have, tho)

But I'm happy to hear the Rev2 is 100% compatible with the BEMI.

_g
Nope . Its the MO range switch , like i said .....

If you look , it was in response to a rev 2 question quoted above it ...
Dunno about BEMI , but in response to that rev 2 question , i'll confirm that a MO range switch is possible .....
Not quite sure why you mention the CO ......
I mentioned the CO, because you said above:
The complex oscillator range is whats missing i believe .
There is no CMPLX Range switch on my Easel. :-)

_g
Nope . That'd qualify as missing.....

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Post by Sonic boom » Wed Dec 30, 2015 10:12 am

Neovintage wrote:
Sonic boom wrote: If you look , it was in response to a rev 2 question quoted above it ...
Dunno about BEMI , but in response to that rev 2 question , i'll confirm that a MO range switch is possible .....
Where is that possible?
You could add a mod to switch between High and Low but if you want it under CV you will also need to create the circuit. This is not on the card.

Well .....i didn't say it was under CV , did i ??
No ....you said that ......

Papz meta expander card essentially has the extra features that are missing from the rev 2 that are on the BEMI units :
such as RV triggered by sequencer pulse ( 1st step only , or switched steps ) , the MO range oscillator (hi/regular/low) , extra sequencer settings (2 steps or random steps - stage number also selectable via pre-amp 'to prog' banana ) , env cv in (for A , S & D times w sliders ) , Comp Osc waveshape ( w/ amount slider ) plus extra KB trigger select (for pulser or envelope - tho i haven't used this feature ) .
I think theres better info on this in another thread on meta program cards .

Many of these features are of course great extenders , but not included in Guy's BEMI easel designed bob as they exist already .
they are obviously very desirable functions (arguably THE most important extending functions ) for any rev 2 208 .

Guy , do you plan to check your BOB with a rev 2 208 , or just sell it as BEMI easel unit ?

Look forward to those videos !

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Post by papz » Wed Dec 30, 2015 10:29 am

The MO higher range mod is simply a switchable positive CV connected to its frequency input, the lower range is a negative one.
No need of any special patch point on the card to achieve this. In the BEMI this is just wired internally.
This certainly works with the CO also (I didn't test).

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shagstaphone
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Post by shagstaphone » Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:40 pm

Interested.

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astroschnautzer
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Post by astroschnautzer » Wed Dec 30, 2015 6:30 pm

Noise source?

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gddfp
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Post by gddfp » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:53 pm

Sonic boom wrote:Guy , do you plan to check your BOB with a rev 2 208 , or just sell it as BEMI easel unit ?
I'd certainly would if there's anyone near (*) Antwerp with a Rev2, willing to bring it over to my ehm, chaos lab.

(*) In Belgium, every city is near every other city. :doh:

_g

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Post by gddfp » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:59 pm

astroschnautzer wrote:Noise source?
I wish. You wish. :party:

I don't really see the use of a noise source as a viable option, since there's no way (known to me) to inject it into the audio path (i.e. to the Gates).
I once asked the BEMI guys how they'd plan to do that with their Expander, but got no answer...

Agreed, noise can be used as a modulation source too, especially low freq noise, but that's already [more or less] possible with the internal RV's + CV-Slew (on my Expander).

_g

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Post by Zeitdehner » Thu Dec 31, 2015 1:37 am

Noise or any other audio signal can be routed to Gate2 via the Aux In jack of the pre amp/env follower section of the 208 :guinness:

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Post by gddfp » Thu Dec 31, 2015 1:45 am

Zeitdehner wrote:Noise or any other audio signal can be routed to Gate2 via the Aux In jack of the pre amp/env follower section of the 208 :guinness:
Darn, yeah... forgot that for a second there.
Must be the gluhwein. :party:

_g

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Post by Neovintage » Thu Dec 31, 2015 4:25 am

Sonic boom wrote:Well .....i didn't say it was under CV , did i ??
No ....you said that ......
I didn't understand you were talking about a simple switch mod, I thought you were mentioned a patch point in the card which doesn't exist.
No need to be pedantic (to my reading).
Papz meta expander card essentially has the extra features that are missing from the rev 2 that are on the BEMI units(...) Many of these features are of course great extenders , but not included in Guy's BEMI easel designed bob as they exist already .
In fact, apart from the MO range switch and the 2-step switch, everything is in it. I see Seq Stages, Attack with pot, Duration with pot, Decay with pot, Complex WS level with pot and Seq, Random, EG, Pulse inputs. So, with Bananas you can trigger much more than with switch. you can even choose between Random 1 and Random 2 without hardwiring on to a switch.

To me this is the best option. If Guy could include the 2 step switch and even the EG looping for 208r that would be great. Pulse Outs lED's too.

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Post by gddfp » Fri Jan 01, 2016 3:40 am

Neovintage wrote:To me this is the best option. If Guy could include the 2 step switch and even the EG looping for 208r that would be great. Pulse Outs lED's too.
Not sure what you mean with "2 step switch" ? If you mean # of sequencer steps, then yes, of course that is available for voltage control.

The Envelope's Mode Select switch isn't [directly] accessible as a patch point on the BEMI card, so... nope. If this is available on the 208r (I dunno), then it certainly must be on one of the few not-taken card fingers... which aren't used on my interface either (no point in forwarding nothing to nothing).

I thought about adding LEDs for the pulses, but there isn't much room left on the 416 Interface board, nor the Expander board. Unless I'd go all SMD, but I'd rather keep this in the easy-DIY domain. And there's all the LEDs you need on the 208 itself, so this is a bit of tricky balance... Is everyone sees this as a must-have feature, I'll try to wiggle it in somewhere.


Happy NewYear everyone !
_g

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Post by Neovintage » Fri Jan 01, 2016 3:52 am

gddfp wrote:Not sure what you mean with "2 step switch" ? If you mean # of sequencer steps, then yes, of course that is available for voltage control.
Yes, on the Easel, there is a switch that choose between 3, 4 & 5 steps. On the card, a 2 step position is available and on can also randomly choose steps under CV. Sometimes it might be useful to have this 2 step option.
gddfp wrote:The Envelope's Mode Select switch isn't [directly] accessible as a patch point on the BEMI card, so... nope. If this is available on the 208r (I dunno), then it certainly must be on one of the few not-taken card fingers... which aren't used on my interface either (no point in forwarding nothing to nothing).
I was referring to this mod : EG looping
But it is probably better to add it elsewhere than on the expansion card, meaning in the 208r directly.
gddfp wrote:I thought about adding LEDs for the pulses(...) And there's all the LEDs you need on the 208 itself, so this is a bit of tricky balance...
Right, I forgot that those are the same. Sorry.

Happy New Year everyone too.
[/quote]

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Post by gddfp » Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:10 am

Neovintage wrote:
gddfp wrote:Not sure what you mean with "2 step switch" ? If you mean # of sequencer steps, then yes, of course that is available for voltage control.
Yes, on the Easel, there is a switch that choose between 3, 4 & 5 steps. On the card, a 2 step position is available and on can also randomly choose steps under CV. Sometimes it might be useful to have this 2 step option.
Actually, this was one of the very first features I added to my twin-Easel BOB prototype.
To me, it's one of the most powerful things on the Easel to have under voltage control. Though it can behave a bit finicky, as most of the Easel's switches do under voltage control.
Neovintage wrote:
gddfp wrote:The Envelope's Mode Select switch isn't [directly] accessible as a patch point on the BEMI card, so... nope. If this is available on the 208r (I dunno), then it certainly must be on one of the few not-taken card fingers... which aren't used on my interface either (no point in forwarding nothing to nothing).
I was referring to this mod : EG looping
But it is probably better to add it elsewhere than on the expansion card, meaning in the 208r directly.
Since I have BEMI Easel(s) only, under warranty, please forgive me that I'm not that much into hardware-modding them... :eek:
Neovintage wrote:
gddfp wrote:I thought about adding LEDs for the pulses(...) And there's all the LEDs you need on the 208 itself, so this is a bit of tricky balance...
Right, I forgot that those are the same. Sorry.
The only LEDs I add, are those for the Panner, Comparators (my best friends on my eBOB), and the Function Generator I'm working on (to replace the LFO on the Expander)... Those LEDs are all on the Dirty GND, so they won't disturb anything much.

_g

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Post by Neovintage » Fri Jan 01, 2016 4:32 am

gddfp wrote: Actually, this was one of the very first features I added to my twin-Easel BOB prototype.
To me, it's one of the most powerful things on the Easel to have under voltage control. Though it can behave a bit finicky, as most of the Easel's switches do under voltage control.
It seems that I didn't succeed to explain it. On the Easel if the steps switch is set to 3, it behaves like 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3... If another switch is added to the card (with the right resistor value), you can have a 2-step switch behaving like 1, 2, 1, 2... Papz did this mod in his card.
Then there is the already existing Seq Stages CV on your expansion card.
Hope I'm clear. :despair:
gddfp wrote:Since I have BEMI Easel(s) only, under warranty, please forgive me that I'm not that much into hardware-modding them... :eek:
Actually the BEMI has the looping mode included but the original Easel and 208r clones have not. So Laurentide Synthworks found a schematic on internet for EG retrigger and post it in the forum. It can easily be add to a vintage or cloned Program Card or cloned Easel.
gddfp wrote:and the Function Generator I'm working on (to replace the LFO on the Expander)...

Will you include a quadrature mode and the OR function?

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Post by doepferiano » Fri Jan 01, 2016 5:49 am

interested in kit

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Post by gddfp » Fri Jan 01, 2016 11:34 am

Neovintage wrote:
gddfp wrote: Actually, this was one of the very first features I added to my twin-Easel BOB prototype.
To me, it's one of the most powerful things on the Easel to have under voltage control. Though it can behave a bit finicky, as most of the Easel's switches do under voltage control.
It seems that I didn't succeed to explain it. On the Easel if the steps switch is set to 3, it behaves like 1, 2, 3, 1, 2, 3... If another switch is added to the card (with the right resistor value), you can have a 2-step switch behaving like 1, 2, 1, 2... Papz did this mod in his card.
Then there is the already existing Seq Stages CV on your expansion card.
Hope I'm clear. :despair:

Yes, totally.
But the thing is, the #steps patch point is available on my Interface, so you can feed that switch any CV you like. If you'd use a switch to just flip it over to two steps, then, IMHO, you're taking the control out of voltage control.
Neovintage wrote:
gddfp wrote:Since I have BEMI Easel(s) only, under warranty, please forgive me that I'm not that much into hardware-modding them... :eek:
Actually the BEMI has the looping mode included but the original Easel and 208r clones have not. So Laurentide Synthworks found a schematic on internet for EG retrigger and post it in the forum. It can easily be add to a vintage or cloned Program Card or cloned Easel.
Yep, the BEMI has EG looping. It's just not available on the standard Program Card.
And I'm definitely not adding anything to the 416 Edge Card itself; it simply feeds forward what's available on the Easel's edge slot.
Neovintage wrote:
gddfp wrote:and the Function Generator I'm working on (to replace the LFO on the Expander)...

Will you include a quadrature mode and the OR function?
No, I'm sorry. There's not room enough on my Expander board for two FG's.
And even with one FG, I still have to test if it works well within the Easel environment... something I'm not 100% sure of. For instance, I thought the VC-LFO would be a nice addition to the Easel feature set, but it quickly turned out that it didn't gel well with it, so I deleted it. It really didn't fit the Easel/Buchla paradigm.

_g

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Post by Neovintage » Fri Jan 01, 2016 3:50 pm

OK, thanks for all your answers. :guinness:

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Post by jimmyambulance » Mon Jan 04, 2016 9:42 am

also interested!

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